(2009-03-04, 03:17 AM)Yumi Wrote: [ -> ] (2009-03-03, 12:03 PM)CraKteR Wrote: [ -> ]It's clear how superior png is over gifs.
Superiority != compatibility.
MKVs are FAR superior to the 16-year old crappy AVIs (if you thought the 8 year old browser is bad, I can tell you a 16 year old media container format is worse), yet many people still use AVI.
How long are you suppose to uphold that compatibility though? Because, last time i checked IE 6 is 8 years old already. I don't think it's fair to the people that actually are upgrading to newer browsers that you, the developers, are holding them back in the early ages..
MKV is rapidly taking it's market share.
Not really I still see more avi's compared to MKVs. Plus sure it's loosing the market share but right now not everyone has access to IE7 or later.
As not everything is like your house where you can just upgrade. Many schools, companies, and organizations base everything around the compatibility they have available to them. And, sadly a lot of that was IE6. And, it's not easy to change everything over night or not worth the cost.
Like Ryan used a hospital as example. I don't see the big deal if you going to change the theme you might as well take the time to make new images anyway.
I don't see the problem for the 18% which uses IE 6 to make new images when they're gonna make a new theme anyways
(2009-03-04, 12:53 PM)bobbit Wrote: [ -> ]I'm confused. What's wrong with adding a decent PNG fix script when MyBB is getting more and more Ajax as it is? Should all the previous and future Javascript work be scrapped and removed because people on IE6 can't use it? :\
We can't just ignore grandma/grandpa when they end up on a MyBB forum and has their Javascript disabled. We wrote MyBB to work just fine with people who don't have Javascript on and we intent to keep it that way.
(2009-03-04, 12:53 PM)bobbit Wrote: [ -> ]Developers that pansy to IE6 are the reason people aren't upgrading quickly enough.
It's not our job to make IT due their darn jobs.
(2009-03-04, 09:29 PM)NetSage Wrote: [ -> ]As not everything is like your house where you can just upgrade. Many schools, companies, and organizations base everything around the compatibility they have available to them.
In most of these places you aren't even supposed to be using the internet for work other than related to the company or school so that's kind-of a mute point.
(2009-03-04, 11:12 PM)Ryan Gordon Wrote: [ -> ]We can't just ignore grandma/grandpa when they end up on a MyBB forum and has their Javascript disabled. We wrote MyBB to work just fine with people who don't have Javascript on and we intent to keep it that way.
It's not our job to make IT due their darn jobs.
So, cutting out schools, companies etc that are on IE6, that'll probably take the total down to what, 5-7%? The cut out 1% for old people... then you really have no excuse.
No, it's not your individual job to phone up the IT guys and say 'Oi you, fix your computers!' but that's not what I said, is it.
(2009-03-04, 12:53 PM)bobbit Wrote: [ -> ]As per W3 stats, IE6 is dropping at a steady rate every month and hasn't gone up.
And are W3 stats representative of the whole internet? Surely not, for:
- they only comprise the English speaking population
- only people interested in web development are likely to visit W3
- from the above point, most likely people with more IT knowledge or in a more IT based environment visit W3, and they are more likely to be using newer tech
(2009-03-04, 01:40 PM)CraKteR Wrote: [ -> ]How long are you suppose to uphold that compatibility though? Because, last time i checked IE 6 is 8 years old already. I don't think it's fair to the people that actually are upgrading to newer browsers that you, the developers, are holding them back in the early ages..
In the majority of cases, developers work for the users, not the other way around.
Consider commercial successes. Microsoft, Apple - why did they succeed? Because they were user focused. They aren't technically superior, but they are more user friendly.
(2009-03-05, 01:45 AM)bobbit Wrote: [ -> ]In most of these places you aren't even supposed to be using the internet for work other than related to the company or school so that's kind-of a mute point.
No, you cannot make that assumption. You do not know the individual requirements of users browsing from company or school computers.
It's quite possible a company may decide to use a discussion board for various purposes, for example.
(2009-03-05, 03:21 AM)Yumi Wrote: [ -> ] (2009-03-04, 12:53 PM)bobbit Wrote: [ -> ]As per W3 stats, IE6 is dropping at a steady rate every month and hasn't gone up.
And are W3 stats representative of the whole internet? Surely not, for:
- they only comprise the English speaking population
- only people interested in web development are likely to visit W3
- from the above point, most likely people with more IT knowledge or in a more IT based environment visit W3, and they are more likely to be using newer tech
(2009-03-05, 01:45 AM)bobbit Wrote: [ -> ]In most of these places you aren't even supposed to be using the internet for work other than related to the company or school so that's kind-of a mute point.
No, you cannot make that assumption. You do not know the individual requirements of users browsing from company or school computers.
It's quite possible a company may decide to use a discussion board for various purposes, for example.
Refer to the end of that same post about W3 stats, and you'll see market share stats. Those are a bit more relative than W3 stats and are there for a reason.
Your latter point is still a minority.
(2009-03-05, 03:33 AM)bobbit Wrote: [ -> ]Refer to the end of that same post about W3 stats, and you'll see market share stats. Those are a bit more relative than W3 stats and are there for a reason.
All these sorts of stats are flawed and I'm sure they can be critiqued in many different ways.
Even if we assume IE6 has 18% market share, that's a lot. If you get 5,000 visitors a day, that's 900 of them on IE6.
(2009-03-05, 03:33 AM)bobbit Wrote: [ -> ]Your latter point is still a minority.
You can't argue that really. I assume you're basing your assumptions from what you observe? If so, be aware of the limitations of your observations, such as the beliefs of those in your environment.
(2009-03-05, 01:45 AM)bobbit Wrote: [ -> ]So, cutting out schools, companies etc that are on IE6, that'll probably take the total down to what, 5-7%? The cut out 1% for old people... then you really have no excuse.
You can't just slice off from figures just because you feel like it.
(2009-03-05, 01:45 AM)bobbit Wrote: [ -> ]No, it's not your individual job to phone up the IT guys and say 'Oi you, fix your computers!' but that's not what I said, is it.
Maybe not literally, but it doesn't take a genius to see how it's insinuated.
I think this conversation is over. It is our decision to stick with gif's until we feel the infamous IE6 isn't going to be a problem market-share wise.