(2017-12-22, 07:37 AM)labrocca Wrote: [ -> ]Anyone can do a responsive design on MyBB. It can be done quickly. Within weeks even. If adding Twig is going to slow the process down then skip that part of it. There already designs for MyBB which are responsive but these break updates and plugins.
Please please please....stop all other work and just focus on redesigning the pages to be responsive. If you did that everything else will fall into place. If you keep up this lack of momentum MyBB is going to become a dinosaur and extinct.
I don't think you know what a responsive design entails. A responsive theme will break all plugins, unless it's a hack job, which i hope we don't see. And, unless work has already begun, you can forget about seeing a result within weeks, especially if only one person is working on the idea.
Quote:A responsive theme will break all plugins, unless it's a hack job, which i hope we don't see.
Yes, I do know that. I know it very well. But the pain has to happen sooner or later and it should have been already done.
Currently everyone using a custom responsive theme not only breaks plugins but also default MyBB updates to templates. So you have a double-whammy. If at the very least MyBB does an official responsive theme we'd have something to work from.
Hell, they don't even need to release it in 1.9. They could just do an "official" responsive theme that's supported and installed by everyone. That could then be adopted by plugin authors and be part of the official 1.10 release.
There is nothing more important for MyBB than to work 100% on a responsive theme. And everyone agrees on that. Everything else is a waste of the teams time.
If we're going to introduce a major breaking change like a new, responsive theme, we might as well only do it once. A new official responsive theme will break
everything because the only way to do it right is to
start over.
Introducing a new templating system like Twig will be a tremendous improvement to the theme system as a whole as it will allow us to have far fewer templates and will be much more flexible than the current system. Implementing SASS support is also incredibly important because it will allow us to use more modular CSS.
It would be a waste of
everybody's time (not just the MyBB team's, but also any plugin or theme creator) for us to create an official responsive theme for 1.8 (which would have to be hacked together and would be far from ideal) and then release a new theme based on a new system for 1.9. That's why we are taking the approach described by Euan above.
I say this as someone who runs a heavily customized
forum with a responsive design. It doesn't use MyBB's stylesheet system - it was easier and quicker to just roll my own stylesheet with SASS. That's why we need to make the improvements to MyBB's template and theme systems first.
(2017-12-22, 12:42 PM)Justin Wrote: [ -> ]If we're going to introduce a major breaking change like a new, responsive theme, we might as well only do it once. A new official responsive theme will break everything because the only way to do it right is to start over.
Introducing a new templating system like Twig will be a tremendous improvement to the theme system as a whole as it will allow us to have far fewer templates and will be much more flexible than the current system. Implementing SASS support is also incredibly important because it will allow us to use more modular CSS.
It would be a waste of everybody's time (not just the MyBB team's, but also any plugin or theme creator) for us to create an official responsive theme for 1.8 (which would have to be hacked together and would be far from ideal) and then release a new theme based on a new system for 1.9. That's why we are taking the approach described by Euan above.
I say this as someone who runs a heavily customized forum with a responsive design. It doesn't use MyBB's stylesheet system - it was easier and quicker to just roll my own stylesheet with SASS. That's why we need to make the improvements to MyBB's template and theme systems first.
I can agree with all of that. But why would this take a year? It should be the only thing MyBB is working on. You say you did it with your own forum using SASS. Did that take you a year?
What if we took up a collection and offered a reward for a 60 day release? Would that get the team motivated? I have a feeling we'd raise thousands of dollars for that. I'd personally go $x,xxx to make it happen by the team. I'm already working with someone making a fantastic design for 1.8x.
Using Twig should make things faster too. It's already a template engine.
You say it's a waste of time for the team to create an official responsive theme. But how do you think the rest of us feel knowing that we may all be wasting our time by making an unofficial responsive theme? It angers me that you're not seeing the importance of this and how it's a serious problem for admins.
There is a disconnect from the teams needs and the communities. You guys don't get it. WE NEED RESPONSIVE NOW. Telling us a year is crazy. You should have done this a year ago. We have to wait till 2019 to have a mobile ready design? Are you kidding me!
Unbelievable. I have to agree with OP about asking whether MyBB has a future or not. Read the first post again.
Quote:The way I see it, is that MyBB is slowly dying because of the lack of compromise of the community and the developers.
It's not slowly dying imho. It's near-death actually and on life-support. A responsive theme is the adrenaline everyone desperately needs from the team. If MyBB team wants to ignore the urgency then fine. It's time everyone consider other options then and a fork will have to happen. Because this is ridiculous.
(2017-12-22, 06:06 PM)labrocca Wrote: [ -> ] (2017-12-22, 12:42 PM)Justin Wrote: [ -> ]If we're going to introduce a major breaking change like a new, responsive theme, we might as well only do it once. A new official responsive theme will break everything because the only way to do it right is to start over.
Introducing a new templating system like Twig will be a tremendous improvement to the theme system as a whole as it will allow us to have far fewer templates and will be much more flexible than the current system. Implementing SASS support is also incredibly important because it will allow us to use more modular CSS.
It would be a waste of everybody's time (not just the MyBB team's, but also any plugin or theme creator) for us to create an official responsive theme for 1.8 (which would have to be hacked together and would be far from ideal) and then release a new theme based on a new system for 1.9. That's why we are taking the approach described by Euan above.
I say this as someone who runs a heavily customized forum with a responsive design. It doesn't use MyBB's stylesheet system - it was easier and quicker to just roll my own stylesheet with SASS. That's why we need to make the improvements to MyBB's template and theme systems first.
I can agree with all of that. But why would this take a year? It should be the only thing MyBB is working on. You say you did it with your own forum using SASS. Did that take you a year?
What if we took up a collection and offered a reward for a 60 day release? Would that get the team motivated? I have a feeling we'd raise thousands of dollars for that. I'd personally go $x,xxx to make it happen by the team. I'm already working with someone making a fantastic design for 1.8x.
Using Twig should make things faster too. It's already a template engine.
You say it's a waste of time for the team to create an official responsive theme. But how do you think the rest of us feel knowing that we may all be wasting our time by making an unofficial responsive theme? It angers me that you're not seeing the importance of this and how it's a serious problem for admins.
There is a disconnect from the teams needs and the communities. You guys don't get it. WE NEED RESPONSIVE NOW. Telling us a year is crazy. You should have done this a year ago. We have to wait till 2019 to have a mobile ready design? Are you kidding me!
Unbelievable. I have to agree with OP about asking whether MyBB has a future or not. Read the first post again.
Quote:The way I see it, is that MyBB is slowly dying because of the lack of compromise of the community and the developers.
It's not slowly dying imho. It's near-death actually and on life-support. A responsive theme is the adrenaline everyone desperately needs from the team. If MyBB team wants to ignore the urgency then fine. It's time everyone consider other options then and a fork will have to happen. Because this is ridiculous.
I cant see anywhere where anybody is saying ti will take a year? My last post in this thread stated that I hoped to have a release ready in 6 months, though that's only an estimate.
(2017-12-22, 06:06 PM)labrocca Wrote: [ -> ]I can agree with all of that. But why would this take a year? It should be the only thing MyBB is working on. You say you did it with your own forum using SASS. Did that take you a year?
Not sure where you're getting a year from. No, it should not take that long, but the SASS and Twig components need to be implemented first. Once those are in place, we can get started on building out the theme. There are already components built out for 2.0, too, that we could reuse.
(2017-12-22, 06:06 PM)labrocca Wrote: [ -> ]You say it's a waste of time for the team to create an official responsive theme. But how do you think the rest of us feel knowing that we may all be wasting our time by making an unofficial responsive theme? It angers me that you're not seeing the importance of this and how it's a serious problem for admins.
I was saying it's a waste to make an official responsive theme for 1.8 if it would be replaced again when SASS and Twig support are added in 1.9, not that a responsive theme should not be a priority. Sorry if that wasn't completely clear.
"Hey I noticed this misspelling. I think we should fix this in the next release"
Mybb team: "Okay amazing idea. Here's a 2 to 5 year roadmap."
"woah woah I don't think it should take-"
Mybb team: "WE ALL HAVE JOBS AND LIVES AND... THIS IS A VOLUNTEER PROJECT."
I'll be honest. If you keep up the excuses, volunteer or not MyBB will die. I understand this isn't anyone's full time gig, but the amount of time you're requiring to make these changes, regardless of the complexity, will kill the project.
(2017-12-22, 09:56 PM)Tactrus Wrote: [ -> ]"Hey I noticed this misspelling. I think we should fix this in the next release"
Mybb team: "Okay amazing idea. Here's a 2 to 5 year roadmap."
"woah woah I don't think it should take-"
Mybb team: "WE ALL HAVE JOBS AND LIVES AND... THIS IS A VOLUNTEER PROJECT."
I'll be honest. If you keep up the excuses, volunteer or not MyBB will die. I understand this isn't anyone's full time gig, but the amount of time you're requiring to make these changes, regardless of the complexity, will kill the project.
Point me to one instance of this happening. I’ll wait.
I also just want to point out that there are a handful of users who've just pulled a time-frame of "2 years" out of thin air with no corroborating evidence whatsoever. We want to have 1.9, which will include the Twig template engine and new theme, out sometime in Q2 of 2018. That's 6 months, not "2 years". This is a reasonable estimate. Get a grip.
Quote:I was saying it's a waste to make an official responsive theme for 1.8 if it would be replaced again when SASS and Twig support are added in 1.9, not that a responsive theme should not be a priority. Sorry if that wasn't completely clear.
Actually that depends.
Let's say in 5-8 weeks you can release an official 1.8x responsive theme. That same theme could be used in 1.9x+ and yes, I understand that even if the theme is the same that the backend coding may change how it's implemented. But that doesn't necessarily change the actual served front-end like the CSS or JS files for example.