(2012-05-19, 12:23 AM)Anxiety Wrote: [ -> ]Not enough good free themes though Alex. I agree with your point - there are very talented designers here. But there's not enough released for free. Without the money or talent to make one yourself; you're very limited.
That's because design is a business. A baker can't just give away all the bread he bakes, so why should a designer give away all the designs he makes?
Thanks for pointing out the obvious... The point I was making was even though running your design business is fine, there needs to be some sort of compromise (imo). Maybe it's because there isn't enough designers here. Every site in the showcase section I've seen pretty much gets slated for not having an original theme if the owner of that forum doesn't have a custom theme or a premium theme.
I'm guilty of doing the same; dishing out that same advice. But personally, I'm sick of seeing below average themes go up for sale when all they've done is a few edits. Not that they sell, but the point remains. The majority seem less than willing to give themes away now, which I understand but resent at the same time. Also, where did I say give away all their designs?
No need to go shooting metaphors at me either.
(2012-05-19, 03:01 AM)Anxiety Wrote: [ -> ]Thanks for pointing out the obvious... The point I was making was even though running your design business is fine, there needs to be some sort of compromise (imo). Maybe it's because there isn't enough designers here. Every site in the showcase section I've seen pretty much gets slated for not having an original theme if the owner of that forum doesn't have a custom theme or a premium theme.
I'm guilty of doing the same; dishing out that same advice. But personally, I'm sick of seeing below average themes go up for sale when all they've done is a few edits. Not that they sell, but the point remains. The majority seem less than willing to give themes away now, which I understand but resent at the same time. Also, where did I say give away all their designs?
No need to go shooting metaphors at me either.
Designers for the most part aren't in this to make or community better; they're in it to make a buck. You can't expect them to compromise and spend their time for no benefit to themselves.
I can't really see how you could expect much more of the showcase section. I'd say that, at the absolute least, 60-70% of people who post in the showcase are (generally) 12 year olds starting their first gaming forum, with no knowledge of how a community is successfully started and run. So of course they won't know the difference between paying for a custom or pre-made, high quality theme (a thing many of them can't do, anyway) and just throwing some free, low quality, overused one up to stray from the default.
And what's wrong with using metaphors to get a point across?
(2012-05-19, 03:01 AM)Anxiety Wrote: [ -> ]Maybe it's because there isn't enough designers here.
I think that's the biggest "problem". There really aren't. Talented folk would rather spend their effort making money. To be frank, there's little incentive to release a good free theme in a market mostly dominated by paid ones.
(2012-05-19, 03:38 AM)Pixlr Wrote: [ -> ]Designers for the most part aren't in this to make or community better; they're in it to make a buck. You can't expect them to compromise and spend their time for no benefit to themselves.
I can't really see how you could expect much more of the showcase section. I'd say that, at the absolute least, 60-70% of people who post in the showcase are (generally) 12 year olds starting their first gaming forum, with no knowledge of how a community is successfully started and run. So of course they won't know the difference between paying for a custom or pre-made, high quality theme (a thing many of them can't do, anyway) and just throwing some free, low quality, overused one up to stray from the default.
And what's wrong with using metaphors to get a point across?
Please, stop treating me like some irritable 14 year old. I know exactly why designers are here. I don't expect them to release their themes for free, I said
in my opinion there should be a compromise. I'm old school, I believe in giving back. MyBB has helped them earn money, give back a nice free theme - my opinion - stop ranting. It's probably a good move for these designers to release some free themes below usual standard but above the already set standard; it gives them decent exposure.
There is no point to get across, that's the point. How ironic.
(2012-05-19, 03:41 AM)Scoutie44 Wrote: [ -> ]I think that's the biggest "problem". There really aren't. Talented folk would rather spend their effort making money. To be frank, there's little incentive to release a good free theme in a market mostly dominated by paid ones.
I agree. Though if I was in their position and had the time and skill, I'm the type who would give back. I honestly think it'd better their designing business anyway. The only way I heard of Jordan was because of his infamous bliss series. Because of that he's earned a lot of money from private requests, you can ask him, I'm sure he'll say I'm right.
There's lots of nice free themes on vB and IPB. Some of the free themes have had more work done to them than any paid theme I've ever seen on MyBB. But again I'm sure that's because of the vast amounts of designers they have.
(2012-05-19, 03:57 AM)Anxiety Wrote: [ -> ]Please, stop treating me like some irritable 14 year old. I know exactly why designers are here. I don't expect them to release their themes for free, I said in my opinion there should be a compromise. I'm old school, I believe in giving back. MyBB has helped them earn money, give back a nice free theme - my opinion - stop ranting. It's probably a good move for these designers to release some free themes below usual standard but above the already set standard; it gives them decent exposure.
There is no point to get across, that's the point. How ironic.
I see where you're coming from, but no, MyBB did not help them make money. If MyBB was not here, they'd be designing webpages, WP themes, etc. Giving them a platform to design on is benefitting, but by releasing a new theme they're not giving back to MyBB, they're giving back to the community of newbie webmasters. Webmasters who are experienced won't care if there are free themes for MyBB, they'll create their own or go and purchase one, and these are the users MyBB wants. We need more users in the Showcase showing off their forums that have over 25,000 posts.
(2012-05-19, 03:41 AM)Scoutie44 Wrote: [ -> ]I think that's the biggest "problem". There really aren't. Talented folk would rather spend their effort making money. To be frank, there's little incentive to release a good free theme in a market mostly dominated by paid ones.
I agree. Though if I was in their position and had the time and skill, I'm the type who would give back. I honestly think it'd better their designing business anyway. The only way I heard of Jordan was because of his infamous bliss series. Because of that he's earned a lot of money from private requests, you can ask him, I'm sure he'll say I'm right.
There's lots of nice free themes on vB and IPB. Some of the free themes have had more work done to them than any paid theme I've ever seen on MyBB. But again I'm sure that's because of the vast amounts of designers they have.
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You can't first state "If I was in their position and had the time and skill" and then comment on the difficulty of a vBulletin/iPB theme. Heck, the reason MyBB themes are easier to make is because of it's amazing theming/template system, it's so versatile that making MyBB themes can be mastered in a month tbh. Doesn't mean you'll be a good designer, but instead knowledgeable with the system itself.
(2012-05-19, 01:28 AM)Pixlr Wrote: [ -> ]That's because design is a business. A baker can't just give away all the bread he bakes, so why should a designer give away all the designs he makes?
This is a weird thing to post considering we're talking about a completely free forum software. Software design is a business, yet here we are.
(2012-05-19, 03:41 AM)Scoutie44 Wrote: [ -> ]I think that's the biggest "problem". There really aren't. Talented folk would rather spend their effort making money. To be frank, there's little incentive to release a good free theme in a market mostly dominated by paid ones.
Free themes provides links (Google PR) and traffic to the author's resource. Links and traffic can be easily converted to money (sell links and ads for example). So even if you create free themes you still can get payback for your work untill someone uses your themes.
(2012-05-19, 04:11 AM)The Elite Wrote: [ -> ]I see where you're coming from, but no, MyBB did not help them make money. If MyBB was not here, they'd be designing webpages, WP themes, etc. Giving them a platform to design on is benefitting, but by releasing a new theme they're not giving back to MyBB, they're giving back to the community of newbie webmasters. Webmasters who are experienced won't care if there are free themes for MyBB, they'll create their own or go and purchase one, and these are the users MyBB wants. We need more users in the Showcase showing off their forums that have over 25,000 posts.
Going by that logic every site with a free theme is doing it wrong. If that's the case, what's the point in free themes? I don't buy into that, I'm sorry. I didn't once say that they'd be on the streets begging for money if it wasn't for MyBB, but the majority of the designers on here I've seen make the most from MyBB themes (guestimating). Having a free theme isn't a bad thing, well, it shouldn't be.
Quote:You can't first state "If I was in their position and had the time and skill" and then comment on the difficulty of a vBulletin/iPB theme. Heck, the reason MyBB themes are easier to make is because of it's amazing theming/template system, it's so versatile that making MyBB themes can be mastered in a month tbh. Doesn't mean you'll be a good designer, but instead knowledgeable with the system itself.
By skill I meant graphic skill. Photoshopping, graphics, all that junk. I know exactly how theme creation works in MyBB and vB/IPB. I just don't have the graphical knowledge - I'm graphic illiterate (
). If I was a graphic nut I'd be making themes constantly (if I didn't run a forum myself). Selling and giving. You've sort of backed my point too. MyBB themes are easy to make because of how simple MyBB has made it, but there's a lack of free themes. We're going round in circles, this isn't rocket science.
Once again, this is my opinion. There needs to be more free themes before it becomes a necessity in MyBB to have a custom theme on a forum you've made.
(2012-05-19, 04:12 AM)brad-t Wrote: [ -> ] (2012-05-19, 01:28 AM)Pixlr Wrote: [ -> ]That's because design is a business. A baker can't just give away all the bread he bakes, so why should a designer give away all the designs he makes?
This is a weird thing to post considering we're talking about a completely free forum software. Software design is a business, yet here we are.
Wierd post? What in the world is wierd about it? It makes sense. If these people can afford having their skills given for free, then great for them. If a designer wants their themes to be released for free, good for them. But that same choice is given vice-versa. If a designer chooses that their time making something that you wouldn't be able to make yourself and put it up so everyone can use it paid then it's their choice. Should a designer be tied down that just because the forum software is free their designs should be free? Lol no, you're trippin'.